YOU'VE GOT TO BE TAUGHT
I've been thinking quite a lot about this particular 'lyric' this last week or so....The GREAT Oscar Hammerstein wrote this particular lyric for the song of the same name, with music by Richard Rodgers, for their now very famous Broadway musical, "South Pacific".
This was written almost 60 years ago, and the above lyric is still as current as if it were written yesterday, I'm sorry to say....and of course it doesn't just apply to the color of one's skin, or the shape of one's eye....it apply's to almost anything that your parents might have believed or that you believe that you pass on to your children or, in the case of your parent's, prejudices that they passed on to you, that became part of your belief system because that is what they believed and ergo, you now still 'feel' that way about...whatever....(Looooonnnnng way around saying: This is how racism of any kind is usually passed on!)
My mother and grandmother hated Crisco.
They were both truly wonderful cooks, and they only used the freshest ingredients and if something called for butter, only butter was used....in truth, only butter was used in all the cooking in our home....And I remember growing up knowing that Crisco was a terrible awful disgusting substitute for butter...NEVER to be used for anything, cause that's what I heard and was taught, from a very very early age!What I've been thinking about is much more hurtful and crippling and in a sense, deadly. I've been rather shocked by the very strong feelings of 'hatred' I have encountered towards the movie "Brokeback Mountain".
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The beauty of being an individual, is that we are all free to express our own opinions.
Hope you've had a wonderful Christmas.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 2:20:00 AM PST
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P.S. Michele sent me here.
- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 2:21:00 AM PST
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Well said. Very good post.
- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 4:14:00 AM PST
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Dear Old Old Lady of the Hills,
I agree with the concept that everyone is to think and learn for themselves on all issues. It is very easy to just accept and adopt what you have been taught as a child without studying or even thinking for oneself.
I have read and studied the Bible on the subject of homosexuality and am confident in what the Word says on the subject.
Do I hate gay people? Never.
I hope in the same way that people not blindly adopt their parents' beliefs, they will not blindly accept Hollywood's teaching on the subject either.
A good post and argument, OOLofH, even though I don't agree with the conclusion.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 7:15:00 AM PST
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Great post, Naomi. With all due respect to Carol, I just don't understand how a film like "Brokeback Mountain" represents Hollywood's "teaching" on the subject. I don't think it's teaching or promoting anything, I think it's just showing the kind of story that has existed for millenia about people who, for the reasons Naomi states, are terrified to express their real selves or love the people they want to love. And then we see the sad, tragic results of that kind of fear and how many lives are ruined in the process.
By the way, Naomi, I am a big butter fan but Crisco is fantastic for things like flaky pie crusts. There IS a terrible awful disgusting substitute for butter but that is MARGARINE! Just say no to Parkay!- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 7:44:00 AM PST
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Great post Naomi! It's great that we can express our opinions. I know that you are truly a loving person to everyone regardless of their race, color, beliefs, etc.
I was taught by my parents that we are to love everyone but we do not have to love their ways.
I personally do not believe in homosexuality because I believe in what the Bible says about it. But I certainly don't feel any hatred towards those who choose to live that way. I have known some wonderful people that are gay!
I hope you'll give Crisco a try! It's not really that bad! :)- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 7:49:00 AM PST
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Very well said, Naomi, and you are not turning me away. I work with a lot of gay people and some of them are the most loving I have ever known. I don't care to see that movie, but I would never condemn it or them.
P.S. There are some things I could not cook were it not for Crisco, but since it is not good for you, I only use it 3-5 times a year.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 7:50:00 AM PST
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Forgot something that is apropos of your post. Last week, I read a post from a Jewish person, who was lashing out at Christians because she was so tired of Christmas. Tired of people telling her Merry Christmas, tired of the carols and other music, tired of the trees and decorations. I thought it was incredibly mean-spirited of her to post that. But I didn't tell her that, I LET IT GO. She is entitled to her opinion, no matter how much I don't agree. It is the same with gays. The Bible exhorts us to love the person, no matter their actions or preferences. Jesus did not say hate the person who engages in homosexuality, he said "Love one another....".
- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 7:55:00 AM PST
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I certainly agree with you. As if there weren't enough truly cataclysmic things to worry about - like global warming, for instance - people have to fuss over where and how other people try to find comfort in this difficult life. Michele sent me.
- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 9:12:00 AM PST
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Naomi, as a Christian I am told in Matthew 7:1, "Do not judge, or you too will be judged." I try to live by that daily.
And, you can't lose me....I'm here to stay! ;)- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 11:30:00 AM PST
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Good post.
Here via Michele.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 11:37:00 AM PST
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Was just thinking how it's not religion but fear of the unkown that fuels wars and hate
Excellent analogy. I know I must have had crisco but never in mother's house.
Our tuna salad was always made with Miracle Whip. In college, my younger sister turned me on to Hellman's. My life has never been the same.
About hatred of gays: when you see many of the best minds of your generation die needlessly, you do begin to learn to hate.
But I refuse to give in to that--though god knows my friends would have been the first people to make fun of them
Blogging can be an amazingly educational experience. Being a New Yorker, I have never experienced true hate
I guess I was that Jewish person. I wasn't lashing out at Christians.
But you don't deserve me to go into a rant here, Naomi. I believe in separation of church and state. It's that simple.
In the few months that you have been here you have made a great impact. Thank you for that. Your blog is wonderful, and fun to come to.
And hope that you're having great holidays.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 12:20:00 PM PST
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We don't have Crisco here but we are a butter only household too.
Other then that I agree with what YellowRose said, I am here to stay.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 12:53:00 PM PST
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Well said, honey :-)
I, for one, am looking forward to Brokeback Mountain. It has had sterling reviews (including yours!).
'To thine own self be true', very wise advice that I didn't follow until well into my 30's.......
cq- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 1:18:00 PM PST
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I was just passing through again. I linked to you from my blog a week or so ago.
I have had many friends that were gay, black, jewish, scottish, danes, germans or other "different from plain vanilla" backrounds and genetic profiles.
I don't know what I believe God thinks about gays. I'm working on it. But he didn't tell me to hate them.
"Love thy neighbor" is hard enough without qualifiers....My current neighbor isn't gay but has a messy with boats, bikes, trailers and stuff yard I hate looking at and three wild boys I hate watching sneak girls into the shed. I have enough to do to love them and they aren't, to my knowledge, gay.
Let God sort them out, live your own way.
I use Crisco for biscuts, white sugar cookies and pie crusts...I hate real mayo and love salad dressing.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 1:18:00 PM PST
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Visiting from Michele's today!
I'm with you. We definitely learn our prejudices from our parents. And I have a few, but I'm aware of them and try to mitigate those feelings that I know stem from what I've learned from others.
And as for Crisco, it definitely is very, very good for certain kinds of baking - pie crusts, sugar cookies. And definitely my bias is with danny - NO MARGERINE! It's awful in baked goods.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 1:21:00 PM PST
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Simply meant that many of my friends didn't live to be 35 because of AIDS
Seem to be on the defensive because for the past two weeks I have been told I'm so many things that I'm not
But you Naomi inspire people to be nice; thanks for that also- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 1:30:00 PM PST
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Sorry I'm not being clear today
Usually save my hatred for Hitler and people like that
Hatred is a strong word that I do try not to use.
I'm tired of the people who in the name of our country or a religion, any religion, spread hate- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 1:57:00 PM PST
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you know this is one of the hardest part of parenting. making sure your kids arent as screwed up as you. I want them to find their own way, but i still need to guide them on to the on ramp... so my kids are taking a right on catholic street, a hard right onto prochoice way, a sweeping left hand turn onto tolerance avenue, and hopefully will kame the run up the onramp onto their own highway without too much trouble.
more than pregudice an dhate is learned at a young age. the religous belifs we hold, even simple things like courtesy. we dont have homophobia in our household. my sister and her girlfriend have been in a commited relationship together for over 20 years (longer than any of my or my mothers marriages) and we hold them up as a good example of love to my children. do i want my sons to be gay? no. would i love them less if they were? hello no. now if they were lawyers i might have a problem!
ps... i like butter flavored crisco, its wonderful.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 1:58:00 PM PST
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great post. It is hard to read about other people who are intolerant. I try to remind myself that hating others hurts me more than it hurts them. It is useless, but many people are trapped in it.
On Crisco, I will say, I once dated a chef, and he made some great pies with Crisco as an ingredient, so I bet you might find some good recipies out there using it. Making something with it might be a good thing to do in 2006.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 2:00:00 PM PST
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and Michele sent me!
- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 2:00:00 PM PST
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Once again, a thought-provoking post about an important subject. I would be a failure as a parent if my child learned hatred from me, and if I didn't do everything possible to let him know how wrong it is when he sees and hears it elsewhere.
I can't wait to see "Brokeback Mountain," simply because I think it was one of the most powerful short stories I've ever read.
Hope your holiday season is joyous, whatever you celebrate.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 2:36:00 PM PST
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Michele sent me, my dear OldOldLady.
Crisco
recipe for you!
As for Brokeback Mountain, I doubt I'll ever see it. While the gay thing is certainly one issue for some, I just don't like seeing tragic romance movies. I can be sad for days, sometimes weeks, after a movie like that. No thanks! I want romantic movies to turn out well--life rarely works that way and I like to watch love follow a gentler path.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 4:51:00 PM PST
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You'll never lose me as a reader. I may not comment much, but I do lurk around often.
As for your comments, I agree and couldn't have said it better. I'm trying to teach my children tolerance for others who do not share their beliefs, kindness to those who are different from them and mostly, be open minded because you never know who your friends are going to be and they wouldn't want to miss an opportunity to have a great or best frind only because of some irrational fear they have because a person is different. You are right, love is love and everyone deserves to find it.
Have a wonderful holiday week.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 6:55:00 PM PST
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Well said. Michele sent me. :-)
- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 6:56:00 PM PST
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Last night we broke open a game my son had gotten as a gift. A simple game aimed for the preschool set. The pieces were little cardboard cut-outs of children. My little pale-skinned, red-headed, blue-eyed boy pointed to the stack of figures and said "I want to be the one with the dark hair."
You see, it never even occured to him that the cartoonish drawing of a boy had different color skin than he did. I can't begin to describe how proud/happy/content/whatever the right word is that made me feel.
You're right. These are things learned - both at home and in the world. I hope to raise children that are not naive and ignorant of the hate that is embodied in some because being ignornant of such makes it impossible to combat. I expect my children will grow to not tolerate such hate. I hope to raise children who embrace people for who they are and not shun them for what they are.
That said, I don't expect I'll see the film - primarily because I don't get out without children attached to me. Makes it hard to take in anything that is not animated. :) I don't even end up renting many films any more. It's all about time. It's the first thing that's been cut from my list of things to do - watching films.
A little tidbit though - when we got out for my husband's birthday to see "Walk the Line" we saw a preview for "Brokeback Mountain." It garnered a wide range of comments amongst the crowd in the darkened theatre. The very next preview was for Heath Ledgers 'other' movie pending release - Casanova. It just seemed odd to me that the two would be paired up, almost as if it was some subtle means to calm the masses that movies about high-testorone, red-blooded males would still be made, and be made by these very men. Go figure.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 7:17:00 PM PST
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Naomi, you and 2 other people just commented on a post I made in September. How did you get there? Did you click into the archives, or did Michele's link direct you there?
It seems odd that 3 people in succession would leave a comment on an old post - so I am thinking that maybe something is wrong with my blogger link.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 7:25:00 PM PST
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I'm dying to see Brokeback Mountain, as you know. I have seen the kind of nastiness regarding the movie on blogs I've perused, and yes, it's been upsetting to me. I can't believe in this day and age that people are so rigid in their bigotry, but I've seen some pretty horrid things around the holiday.
Crisco isn't a Jewish thing, I don't think. We never had it in my house growing up, and I don't have it either, but I have to admit it does make great pie crusts if you cut it half and half with butter. Easier to roll out, too. But we're huge butter fans. Why use anything else?
Michele...- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 7:26:00 PM PST
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very well said. it is not for us to judge another. prejudice is laziness. if people would take the time to look past prejudice, they may accidently find a wonderful person...maybe even a friend.
clicked from micheles- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 7:52:00 PM PST
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One of the things I love about you the most is you stand true to your convictions. I don't understand people who are religious, know the bible, yet hate homosexuality....yet you don't see them raising this issue with liars or drunkards. The bible mentions homosexuality less than 5 times. Yet, liars & drunks are mentioned over 20 times each. I think people get hung up with the sex issue about it & it's not about sex. Heck, if I think of most heterosexual people I know having sex, it totally grosses me out!
Jesus was love, plain & simple.
People can justify hating anyway they want to. It's just wrong!
If we can't love our brothers whom we can see, how can we claim to love God whom we can't see? I forget who said that, but I believe it was someone wise.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 9:25:00 PM PST
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Great message and one that needed to be said. Homophobia is one of the most rampant and sad intolerances today and is definitely passed down through the generations. All prejudice is sad and hateful.
As far as your Crisco hatred, well maybe you haven't actually TRIED Crisco! Bet you try one round of Crisco Twister and you never speak disparagingly of it again! ;) Come on...try it.- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 10:26:00 PM PST
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I am so with Yellow Rose's comment. That is how I try to live my life as well. I have close family members who will argue the "abomination" route about homosexuality. Honestly,I have not done an in-depth enough Bible study to buy that at this point at all. I just know that love, is love. And two people who are kind and loving to each other have to be better than the opposite, regardless of their sexual preferences.
Interesting and thought provoking post. Thanks for visiting me twice tonight via Michele! Looks like we're both night owls!- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 10:28:00 PM PST
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Dearest Naomi. Three cheers for you!!! My favorite exchange on the subject of homosexuality was between my little five-year-old nephew and his friend. My nephew said to his friend that he loved him to which the friend responded, "Are you gay?" My nephew asked "What's gay?" The friend answered: "It's when a boy loves a boy." To which my nephew with absolute conviction and enthusiasm answered: "Yeah! I'm gay!" If only we could all be guided by our inner five-year-old nephew!!!
- Monday, December 26, 2005 at 11:19:00 PM PST
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Morning, dear OOL :-)
Came here from Michele's this time..
Crappy start to today - but I guess it can only get better....
I'm ok loving my fellow man, but I could happily throttle a certain feline today....[wry grin]
cq- Tuesday, December 27, 2005 at 2:02:00 AM PST
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Terrific post!
Oh, and I was in South Pacific in high school. One of my favorites!- Tuesday, December 27, 2005 at 4:52:00 AM PST
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When I was a girl my family used some Crisco, not because it was a good product but because we were a family of 9 kids and we couldn't afford butter!
I'm very much looking forward to seeing that movie and hope it opens minds.- Tuesday, December 27, 2005 at 6:56:00 AM PST
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I surfed into your blog quite by accident. What you wrote echoes so very much what's in my own heart. It is so sad that people are so closed minded and filled with such blind, ignorant prejudice and hatred. It's rampant anymore. Hint: What we've been taught or maybe had pushed and ingrained into our heads ISN'T ALWAYS RIGHT!!!!! You voiced your opinion - and very eloquently I might add - and I happen to agree with you completely. I'm not saying people should agree with us. That is THE POINT....people should think for themselves and draw their own conclusions that come from the depths of their own souls.
- Tuesday, December 27, 2005 at 9:50:00 AM PST
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Thank you so much for sharing such a profound post. I truly do not understand how there can be so much hatred in this country against homosexuals. Have we learned nothing? I was raised Catholic & I thought that the bible taught us "thou shall not judge" or "Love thy neighbor". It sickens me when people use the bible & religion to justify their hatred. It's one of the reasons I turned away from organized religion at a very young age. I do truly hope that love will eventually prevail.
- Tuesday, December 27, 2005 at 11:15:00 AM PST
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hello... michele sent me!
- Tuesday, December 27, 2005 at 11:22:00 AM PST
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Good riddance to anyone you might turn off!
Don't worry about it. Who needs friends who are ignorant and narrow-minded? I prefer to have intelligent and compassionate friends.
Here, yet again I have seen the typical, ignorant remarks you hear everytime the subject of homosexuality is brought up. What I have to say is:
You don't have to "believe in" homosexuality; IT EXISTS! Whether you "believe in" it or not.
Hollywood is not "TEACHING" anything! It's depicting a fact of the human condition.
Neither does the Bible "TEACH" that homosexuality is an abomination. God SAYS it is, just like he says that vengeance belongs to Him. It is not our place to judge and play God. (There is TONS of incest in the Bible, also; is the Bible "teaching" you that is acceptable?)
The Bible is God's word, and God will decide what happens to "sinners". The purpose of the Bible is for guidance of OUR OWN lives and not to use as a "Rule Book" against which to judge others.
There are too many mis-guided Christians who need to spend more time NOT studying the Bible, and NOT memorizing verse, but exploring the true meaning of the words the Bible contains.
/ end rant- Tuesday, December 27, 2005 at 11:31:00 AM PST
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Yep, I'm the one always saying "Why can't we all just get along??" I truly don't understand the hate that people hold in their hearts and foster in their children based solely on appearance, romantic preference, skin color, religion, etc. I'll probably wait a bit longer to see Brokeback Mountain just because I'm a Netflix girl, but to me it's a love story. That it happens to be about two men just gives it a different twist from most of the "romances" we see in Hollywood. Thank you for taking yet another controversial subject and making such a clearheaded discourse out of it. As always, I very much enjoyed my visit here from Michele's!
- Tuesday, December 27, 2005 at 12:06:00 PM PST
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I have always loved and appreciated that song. I made my 8th graders memorize it every year for 26 years.
You rock, by the way.- Tuesday, December 27, 2005 at 10:06:00 PM PST
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I think you said that really, really well. If only more people embraced your philosophy and stopped judging and hating without really knowing who they are judging and hating, our world would be a much better place.
Greetings from chilly and gloomy Wisconsin. Hope your weather in L.A. is much better.
Michele sent me!- Wednesday, December 28, 2005 at 12:05:00 PM PST
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Thank you for this post. I was feeling really annoyed and upset after i surfed through a blog just recently which wrote down all her prejudices and insults against my country and the people who live here. if there are people out there who are TRULY unprejudiced and who see beyond color, race, 1st, 2nd, 3rd or 4th world country ranking (or whatever you call it), socio-economic class and gender, then my heart goes out to all of you... and i pray God blesses you in the coming year.
- Thursday, December 29, 2005 at 8:50:00 AM PST
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Naomi, you are right on the dot here. I've read all the previous comments and a lot of them voice exactly how I feel...love is love is love.
I also like to remember the song by Peter, Paul and Mary called:
Jesus Is On The Wire"
Run down church
Red clay
River covered
In a smoky haze
Sunday morning
The fire is out
Sunday morning
No one about
The earth is soft
This time of year
Boots get caked
From there to here
Down the road
Route 25
They found this boy
He was barely alive
Jesus is on the wire
So far away, higher and higher
Jesus is on the wire
They took him down
Off the fence
Cold as ice
Almost dead
They said that he
That he slept with guys
They said that he
Deserved to die
Jesus is on the wire
So far away, higher and higher
Jesus is on the wire- Thursday, December 29, 2005 at 9:35:00 PM PST
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We are all created by the same miracle, which many people call God. If God is so against homosexuality why would he/she have created homosexuals? There is a continuum of human sexuality, sometimes obvious at birth, with male on one end and female on the other. In between are naturally occurring conditions (remember - we are all created by God) where gender is actually physically mixed. Who are we to decide that God made a mistake and that any one of us mere humans knows better? Perhaps there is an important spiritual reason that there is a continuum of human sexuality, and God's point is to test our reactions by making the situation slightly less than simple. The homophobes would therefore be in serious trouble with God when judgement time arrives for them.
I have known a few kids who were obviously born gay. They didn't yet know it as children but it was obvious that they were simply created that way by God. There was no human decision involved in the process. God knows better than any human, so to judge his/her creations and hate them is the greatest sin I can imagine.
How any religion has decided otherwise, especially in view of the phrase 'God is Love' is absolutely beyond me. The way I feel about anyone who hates homosexuals is ... God forgive them, for they know not what they do.- Saturday, December 31, 2005 at 10:35:00 AM PST
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Thank you for your wise words about this movie. I've not seen it yet, but plan to with my daughter who asked me to take her. (She's 16 and needs to be 17 in our state to see it without a parent.)
Last year their high school theatre, put on the production "The Laramie Project".Awesome perfomance!I say this unbiased, even if both of my daughters were part of that controversial show. It was up for several "Cappie" nominations. We had an exciting evening at the Kennedy Center for such.
From my daughters being in theatre and me as an artist, we often meet people of all kinds. Homosexuality or bisexuality is not a choice. (Many will argue with me...) The resultant hatred, bias, cruelty, and more that occurs too often, tears my heart apart. Well said and timely post.- Sunday, January 1, 2006 at 3:11:00 AM PST
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I use Crisco when I'm making pie crust (and I'm told I make very good pies). I've tried butter, but Crisco really makes the lightest, flakiest crust, especially good for pies like lemon merangue and key lime. The secret is to make the dough and then refrigerate it for a few hours, because the dough should be rolled out and placed in the oven when cool.
The Crisco website explains why and how:
Pie Tips
Baking a pie really is easy as pie! If you've never made piecrust, all it takes is a little practice (really!) and following three simple steps to turn out a tender, flaky crust every time.
Cold ingredients are key to a flaky crust. Using ice water and cold (even frozen) Crisco® Shortening is important. Chill the dough for about an hour before rolling to help prevent sticking. When the pie crust goes in the oven, the cold shortening will stay solid long enough for the crust to set, creating small "pockets" in between the layers of dough as it melts. Voila!—a flaky crust.
Minimal handling helps to achieve a tender crust. Think of a nice, crusty, chewy piece of bread... it got that way by lots of kneading to develop the gluten in the flour. This is exactly what you are trying to avoid when making a tender piecrust. Handle the dough just enough to mix it and roll it—no more.
Proper rolling is another way to avoid excess handling. Roll the dough from the center out, lifting the pin after each roll. In addition to keeping the dough tender, this method will also help you achieve a nice, round shape. To easily get the rolled crust from the counter to the pie pan, lift half the crust, lay it over the rolling pin, and then transfer it into the pan. Be careful not to pull or tug the dough when fitting it in the pie pan—it can cause the dough to shrink when baking.
For a beautiful finish, you can glaze a double-crust pie with a beaten egg or egg white mixed with a little water. For an extra-special touch, sprinkle the top crust with a little granulated sugar. Bake pies on a lower rack in the oven, where the concentrated heat will cook the bottom crust as nicely as the top. About halfway through baking, check on the pie—you may need to cover it with foil to prevent over-browning.- Monday, August 4, 2008 at 12:41:00 PM PDT
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